04 Jul
Francoeur finally, at long last, sent to the minors game thread: July 4, Astros at Braves
You all know this by now, of course, but Jeff Francoeur was finally sent to the minors this morning. And he whined about it.
The Braves called up Jason Perry in his place. Perry’s a minor league slugger who’s having a good year, but I wouldn’t expect anything more than ordinary offense out of him. Of course, ordinary offense would be a huge upgrade.
Who’s gonna be the Delta spokesman for the next 2 weeks? Corky?
July 4th, 2008 at 2:10 pm“Delta flies direct to Jackson, Mississippi, where you can easily find a commuter flight to Pearl, to see me, star outfielder Jeff Francoeur!”
July 4th, 2008 at 2:12 pmFrom the last thread:
Not exactly a major revelation, but the worst thing that happened to JF is that hot start. It would have been better for his long term prospects if he had struggled out of the gate. Then he and the team would have realized that he had more work to do to become a quality major leaguer, which is painfully obvious to anyone who cares to look now.
It’s not surprising that he was hurt by the demotion. He’s obviously a highly competitive guy. However, he should have had the sense to keep his mouth shut to the press, it only makes you look bad in the end.
I like JF as an individual based on the limited exposure I have as a fan of the team. Seems basically like a good kid. But I’m not optimistic on his long term chances for success. Maybe he’ll see the light and change his approach at the plate. But somehow I doubt it.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:14 pmJeff shows his age here (I’m only a year older for what it’s worth). Total lack of class. I’m sure it won’t be long before he issues an “apology” for his comments, but his self-entitled attitude really sours me on him.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:19 pmSorry, from the last thread:
What would I have done? Easy, been more patient, perhaps give him more time off and allow him to work through it. I know that bothers some people, but it’s worked well for the Braves in the past. I can’t remember the last time a player with at least 2 years under his belt has been demoted like this. I just think he’s earned enough respect to be given more of a chance. It’s like Chipper said about hitting .400, he probably won’t since he’s a career .330 hitter. Well, Jeff is not a career .230 hitter, so why do you think he’s lost the ability to play better? Slumps happen in baseball even to the best of the players. I think it was Chip on TV the other day that said Joe Dimaggio was something like 9 for 60 before he went on his 56 game hitting streak.
As far as putting someone else out there who can outperform him, who is that? An unproven call-up in a high pressure situation? Why not allow someone to split time with him to see if someone else can earn the position?
And yeah, I guess I’m just not a win at all costs kind of guy. If I were, I’d root for the Yankees who spend twice as much as any other team and panic when they don’t win every game. Was John Smoltz dominating in his first couple of years? How about Glavine? No, they were all given time to get better. I’d rather they trade Francoeur instead of this slap in the face kind of move.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:24 pmChipper is a .330 hitter over the course of 13 years. Jeff is a .272 hitter over the course of three. It’s not just a slump for Jeff. He’s playing stupid baseball, and THAT’s what needs fixing.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:30 pmHe has sucked the whole year Todd. What else could they do?
July 4th, 2008 at 2:30 pmYou have to be kidding me. A “slump”? This isn’t a slump. This is a half-season of being the worst regular player in baseball, a player with no positives — a bad batting average, a terrible walk rate, no power to speak of, horrible baserunning on those few occasions when he finds himself on base, hitting even worse in key situations, and bad defense.
This team is not meant to be a structure for Jeff Francoeur to work out his problems. They’re talking about completely breaking down his swing and rebuilding it from scratch. You think doing that on the major league level is a good idea?
Trade him? Who’d want him? Trading a player when his value is at its lowest is stupid.
“I can’t remember the last time a player with at least 2 years under his belt has been demoted like this.”
Short memory. The Phillies demoted Brett Myers earlier this week. The Phillies also are in first place and just pummeled us. None of this is a coincidence.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:31 pmTodd sounds like a Braves employee. Stay the course, don’t rock the boat, and let guys “play their way” out of team-and-season-killing slumps.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:32 pmHe probably also thinks we’re “one or two players away” from the World Series.
“I think it was Chip on TV the other day that said…”
You’re not going to win many arguments starting sentences like that.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:42 pmJoe DiMaggio > Jeff Francoeur
July 4th, 2008 at 2:44 pmMac, I was talking about the Braves not demoting a player in that situation. Just b/c the Phils did it doesn’t justify it. And yeah, I was disgusted by getting swept by the Phils as well, but I don’t think that can be blamed on one guy.
And Brad, that way of thinking did pretty well for the Braves during their 14 yr playoff run, didn’t it? As much as I hate to say it, I think we’re going to miss Schuerholz more than we might think.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:48 pmWhat does Schuerholz have to do with Jeff not hitting ?
July 4th, 2008 at 2:50 pmMost of that playoff run was benefitted by 3 Hall of Fame starting pitchers and very few budget constraints.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:52 pmYeah Chip was definitely comparing Jeff to Joe DiMaggio and Reggie Jackson. He also brought up Utley’s 0 for 24 skid, who since has gone something like 17 for 34. I was devastated to hear that this put a “damper” on his relationship with the Braves. Doesn’t he know what’s best for him?
Someone in the previous thread said it best: if it was anyone else on the team they would have been shipped out weeks ago.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:52 pmNew trade rumor: Francouer, Corky, & Hampton to the Rays for a cardboard cutout of Jonny Gomes to play RF.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:53 pmI miss the 2003 Braves. I really enjoyed watching that team play. Sorry for bringing Nostalgia into this.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:54 pmFrancoeur to Washington for Pete Orr, Willie Harris, and Ryan Langerhans.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:55 pmI miss Langerhans. I told my wife after the ’05 season that he was gonna be a really good player. Oops…..at least he played good defense
July 4th, 2008 at 2:59 pmThe Braves had no problem shipping out Mark Wohlers, who had been with the team far longer than Francoeur has and accomplished far more, including an All-Star appearance in 1996. Wohlers’ collapse is a good parallel for Francoeur’s current miseries. They released Ron Gant in 1993 when he broke his leg.
July 4th, 2008 at 2:59 pmIt could all turn around, but aren’t we glad JF doesn’t have a McCann sized contract.
July 4th, 2008 at 3:07 pmWell, it might have been better to DL him and work on rebuilding his swing in Orlando. Then, a rehab stint in Mississippi for a couple of weeks followed by some growing pains back in Atlanta.
This would have been better for his ego, reputation, and pocket book.
The thing is – Francoeur is not far from being the best outfielder on the team. If they can get him moving in the right direction over a few weeks, he might be of value to the team even as he works out some kinks in the Majors.
July 4th, 2008 at 3:20 pmDitto on the contract. He was given a couple of opportunities. I am sure a competitive guy like him does not like getting a giant “told-you-so” from the team he turned down.
July 4th, 2008 at 3:21 pmIf there is one organization that doesn’t tolerate back-talk it is the Braves. Remember when Roman Colon insinuated he’s been demoted before the team flew to the West Coast (and he had a legitimate complaint and poor English)?
July 4th, 2008 at 3:40 pm“It’s the magic in every game. It’s the look on a kid’s face as the poster on his wall gets sent to the minor leagues.”
July 4th, 2008 at 3:58 pmWell, this sucks.
July 4th, 2008 at 3:58 pmWow, the quotes in that article…there are no words. What a complete moron.
“A damper on my relationship”? Good Lord, you have been incredibley blessed to be getting a major league pre diem for as long as you have. No other team would have stuck with you that long.
He wanted a warning? He really needed to be told that playing like horseshit might eventually have repercussions? How dumb can he be?
July 4th, 2008 at 4:00 pmIt seems to me that this move is not only necessary but overdue, by a couple of weeks. He hasn’t played well all year and it has cost the Braves. To be sure he isn’t the only cause of the Braves poor record. Injuries, too, are a problem, but they can’t be helped. Sucking can be dealt with, and one reasonable way of dealing with it is demotion. Hopefully, they’ll be able to help Francouer. Moreover, if this has damaged their working relationship, then it’s all the more important to fix his swing and other parts of his game, effectively raising his value so that he can be dispatched for something other than six dozen baseballs and a dozen maple bats (that Chip and Joe can yell about).
July 4th, 2008 at 4:14 pmGuys,
The AJC wanted an interview right after he was told he was being demoted. Give the kid a break. There were a lot of emotions involved in that conversation. I seriously doubt he meant some of those comments.
Is it possible for some of you to quit complaining? You complained about him being here. Now he is sent to the minors and you’re complaining how he handled it. Some of you need to either get drunk, screwed, or both.
July 4th, 2008 at 4:23 pmRobert: Agree 100%
July 4th, 2008 at 4:39 pmBuster Olney is currently doing post-game analysis of an eating contest. Is ESPN holding his family hostage or something?
July 4th, 2008 at 4:50 pmI hope Francoeur really does take his swing apart and start from scratch.
This may have been posted before, but here is commentary and video on Francoeur’s swing by trainer Jeffrey Albert at swingtraining.net: http://blog.swingtraining.net/2006/07/18/jeff-francoeur-and-the-x-factor.aspx
Albert also wrote a sequel to that article:
http://blog.swingtraining.net/2006/08/04/jeff-francoeur-part-2.aspx
Francoeur seems pretty pissed that the team demoted him, but if he goes to Mississippi with a closed mind then he’ll screw over the team and himself.
July 4th, 2008 at 4:55 pmwow; great stuff on frenchie swing. if some guy on the net can figure this out, can the Braves?
July 4th, 2008 at 5:02 pmWow, I have to agree with everyone: what did you expect, Jeff? You’ve been playing terrible and you got demoted. Read the AJC, and you would have been given warning that your demotion was being discussed. I think this will be good for JF, but I agree that he didn’t show very much class with his frustrations.
July 4th, 2008 at 5:16 pmI have never been a Francoeur fan. But I’m starting to actively dislike him, and he may have crossed the Lockhart Line with these whiny, self-entitled comments.
July 4th, 2008 at 5:36 pmI don’t know what the Golden 13-Year-Old thinks the Braves owe him. He’s only been in the league for about 3 years, and he’s been below replacement level for about half of that time. He sure isn’t acting like much of a team player.
July 4th, 2008 at 5:41 pmWaiting for Landogarner’s take…
July 4th, 2008 at 5:41 pmMac, you didn’t like Francouer when he had a .300/.350/.540 line and finished second in the league in assists in half a season? I can understand resenting him for his incredibly long leash, but for the most part he’s been a good guy, a good teammate, puts butts in the stands, and he plays hard.
July 4th, 2008 at 5:41 pmTalking about players who’ve lost their swings, Andruw comes back from the DL and so far has 4 K’s in 5 AB, good job guy!
July 4th, 2008 at 6:04 pmI’m pretty sure JF and every other Brave doesn’t care what anyone on this or any other blog thinks about them.
July 4th, 2008 at 6:19 pmIf that is the case, Jake, why do you get so upset about it?
Nice catch by Kotsay.
July 4th, 2008 at 6:38 pmNo, I didn’t. I’m on record saying that his 2005 was fluky, and going into the 2006 season saying that McCann was the better player and more important to the team.
July 4th, 2008 at 6:41 pmI don’t care that he doesn’t care. Nyah.
And FWIW, I can drink, screw and complain, all at the same time. On the phone while smoking and driving even. Top that, Mr. French Fry.
GO BRAVES!!
July 4th, 2008 at 6:50 pmGood read on Yunel Escobar and his defection.
http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=431019
July 4th, 2008 at 6:59 pmA lead, whoo!!!
July 4th, 2008 at 7:05 pmPretty sure most of the team will be utterly confused now.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:07 pmJason Perry = Replacement Level
Jeff Francoeur < Replacement Level
July 4th, 2008 at 7:09 pmJason Perry For President
July 4th, 2008 at 7:10 pmPerry is the anti-Frenchy.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:10 pmJP! (with help from Hunter)
July 4th, 2008 at 7:10 pmNice one, kid! Looks like he might have “easy power.”
July 4th, 2008 at 7:11 pmFWIW, Perry not only played with Teixeira at Tech, but also Matt Murton.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:13 pmHow does someone with a career line of .291/.369/.520 in almost 2400 minor league ABs not even get a cup of coffee by now? His platoon split for this season is pretty brutal in a small sample size, but he could seemingly match with a healthy Diaz in left, or platoon with Frenchy (yeah right) if he’s still not quite ready when he inevitably returns. If he comes close to his minor league numbers at all he could be a valuable player.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:19 pmWell,
I’m willing to give Frenchy the benefit of the doubt. This is probably the first time in his life that he’s been an athletic failure (and even that is debatable – failure vs. not as successful as everyone hoped), so I can understand the bitterness. I’m sure he believed he was getting ready to turn it around – he, like every other pro athlete, has a HUGE amount of self-confidence in his skills.
I’m interested to see how he handles this after this weekend. Will he still whine and sulk? Or will he buckle down, and work hard on fixing the issues? If we hear at the end of next week how Frenchy is working hard at Mississippi, and his teammates love him and his work ethic, then I believe he’ll turn out fine. (It may take a couple years, but he’s still just 24).
Godspeed Jeff, and I hope we’ll see you back in Atlanta soon.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:20 pmI know it’s been a while, but I can’t help wishing we would bean Darin Erstad.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:20 pmFrancoeur just had a 2 run HR taken back, initially ruled fair but then called foul. Diaz was on base
July 4th, 2008 at 7:24 pmThat kinda looked like a busted hit-and-run.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:26 pmJosh, the remarkable thing is that he’s spent most of his career in the A’s organization, and you’d think they would have given him a shot.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:27 pmis this team actually getting hits with RISP and TWO outs? Wow.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:30 pmThe Good Tim Hudson is in.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:37 pmShorts and long socks doesn’t work for Smoltz
July 4th, 2008 at 7:38 pmAn interesting series of events:
- Matt Diaz walks.
- Mississippi Braves Manager Phillip Wellman ejected by 3B umpire Travis Brown.
- Jeff Francoeur walks. Matt Diaz to 2nd.
I guess Wellman got thrown out about that homer.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:39 pmBig cheer for Perry.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:40 pmThat’s very puzzling Mac. Maybe the Perry & Campillo signings, coupled with our miraculous rise to the pennant will inspire someone to write “Wrenball”…a guy can dream, right?!
As braves14 pointed out, replacement level is better than what we’ve been getting from RF. Here’s hoping that .889 OPS doesn’t drop-off too much in the bigs.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:42 pmFrenchie .761 career OPS (includes is hot start). Perry has some room to drop, and still be better.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:46 pmMan, Huddy is dealing.
July 4th, 2008 at 7:52 pmWalk the pitcher, boot the DP, = 1 run.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:04 pmHe had to get five outs that inning — well four outs, and one of them twice — so it’s not a bad job facing Berkman & Lee to hold them to one run.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:09 pmI think Francoeur has been dragging McCann down.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:14 pmKJ!
July 4th, 2008 at 8:15 pmKJ!
July 4th, 2008 at 8:15 pmYeah! way to make up for the botched play, Kelly!
July 4th, 2008 at 8:15 pmHow in the world did Moehler come into this game with a sub-four ERA? He looks terrible, but no more terrible than usual, and is lucky he’s only given up five runs.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:16 pmw00t! Glad to see Kelly knock one out. He’s only had 3 in May and June combined.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:17 pmMan, a lineout and two deep, hard-hit fly balls. Kinda a shame to only get two out of that.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:17 pmGreat play by Yunel there. This is more like it.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:19 pmIt’s weird that Blanco steals for a preposterously higher percentage at the ML level than he was doing in the minors.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:35 pmNot hard to see which piston wasn’t firing …
July 4th, 2008 at 8:37 pmMy guess about Blanco would be that they haven’t been sending him as much, so it’s less predictable. I’ll take a good quality percentage over a mediocre quantity anyday.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:41 pmBobby, please don’t use Gonzo with a 5 run lead.
July 4th, 2008 at 8:57 pmA win!
July 4th, 2008 at 9:08 pmbraves14 -
“Bobby, please don’t use Gonzo with a 5 run lead.”
Why the hell not?! When you’ve lost your last five and seen your relievers load the bases last inning, why in God’s name do you not go to your closer to secure the win? I mean, Gonzo’s last game was… last Friday.
July 4th, 2008 at 9:19 pmRecap up.
July 4th, 2008 at 9:24 pmhttp://www.gadsdentimes.com/article/20080704/NEWS/527639831/1017/NEWS
Hey, some good news on the prospect front…Tyler Stovall just signed with the Braves today. He got a pretty good deal, too. Rumor has it the Braves promised him that he was going to be their first pick and then they took the pitcher from Florida first instead. That’s probably why they had to pay the money they did for him compared to last year’s 64th pick.
July 4th, 2008 at 9:35 pm